Updated

Steffa97
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Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:49 pm

Updated

Sun Mar 30, 2014 7:43 pm

Ground based melee, as much as I like it, won't work in this Aracoix/Scout/Aracoix-Scout-bane world we have going on so I tweaked my template a bit to thoroughly cremate scouts if they're dumb enough to start the attack.
Still Aelfborn for snare-break
Same starting runes
Discs -
Traveler (optional)
Gladiator (Preferred but not really required, replace Black Mask need be)
Black Mask (free passwall, can be replaced with Glad)
Blade Master
Archer
25CON
30DEX

Stats at 75
DEX - 160
CON - 120
INT - 74

Gold
Bow
Archery
Light Armor

Take Beastcraft to 115 and put a point in Wolfskin. Emergency heal, small stat buff, GM mana-based weapon powers
Take Briallia's Power to 18 and GM the zeal. JM Precision and Feint <----- the reason I still have Blade Master
GM the Ranger heal (it should be going off for around 110-410) and it's free bleed remove. Gladiator also gives health regen, and with the Ranger heal, you should be outhealing most bow scouts anyway.
Jewels are either 20DEX, or 10DEX/CON with health recovery. If you get a full set of Vorg (which I wholeheartedly recommend), feel free to go full-con. At the end you should be sitting with around 3250HP with all dex jewels, and around 3600 with dex/con. The LA hood can also be subbed for another con hood for extra HR/HP, that'll bring you to about 3750 with con jewels.
Defense with full-dex jewels, and +8def/pierce resist Ranger LA is resting at about 2050.
ATR with Feint/Precision stacked is pushing slightly over 3,000. You should be able to blast scouts for almost 250-300 a hit consistently without weapon powers while he's barely tickling you. Not to mention your heals will keep you alive much better than the best one a Scout can get, which is the RC heal.
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Sek
Snowy Mino
Snowy Mino
Posts: 727
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:31 am

Re: Updated

Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:13 pm

Steffa97 wrote:Ground based melee, as much as I like it, won't work in this Aracoix/Scout/Aracoix-Scout-bane world we have going on so I tweaked my template a bit to thoroughly cremate scouts if they're dumb enough to start the attack.
Still Aelfborn for snare-break
Same starting runes
Discs -
Traveler (optional)
Gladiator (Preferred but not really required, replace Black Mask need be)
Black Mask (free passwall, can be replaced with Glad)
Blade Master
Archer
25CON
30DEX

Stats at 75
DEX - 160
CON - 120
INT - 74

Gold
Bow
Archery
Light Armor

Take Beastcraft to 115 and put a point in Wolfskin. Emergency heal, small stat buff, GM mana-based weapon powers
Take Briallia's Power to 18 and GM the zeal. JM Precision and Feint <----- the reason I still have Blade Master
GM the Ranger heal (it should be going off for around 110-410) and it's free bleed remove. Gladiator also gives health regen, and with the Ranger heal, you should be outhealing most bow scouts anyway.
Jewels are either 20DEX, or 10DEX/CON with health recovery. If you get a full set of Vorg (which I wholeheartedly recommend), feel free to go full-con. At the end you should be sitting with around 3250HP with all dex jewels, and around 3600 with dex/con. The LA hood can also be subbed for another con hood for extra HR/HP, that'll bring you to about 3750 with con jewels.
Defense with full-dex jewels, and +8def/pierce resist Ranger LA is resting at about 2050.
ATR with Feint/Precision stacked is pushing slightly over 3,000. You should be able to blast scouts for almost 250-300 a hit consistently without weapon powers while he's barely tickling you. Not to mention your heals will keep you alive much better than the best one a Scout can get, which is the RC heal.

Nice build.

Now, a few suggestions/questions:

- Is going Aelf really worth it? With level 30 archery powers your snare will be 41% (if the Wiki is correct, until checking it out tonight I was under the impression that GM weapon powers give you 41% snares). Most scouts, with spiked running should be faster than you, even if you keep that snare on them.

- No points into dodge? Not that it`s mandatory, but I like to put at least 10 trains in.

- Is JM-ing Feint necessary? Ok, you need good ATR, but just remember, Feint also gives you an attack speed debuff, that scales with trains...

- Also, I dislike going over 90 trains into anything on a Ranger, simply because there are always other useful stuff to spend trains on.

And finally, one straight-out question:
- Would you train up Find Weakness on your bow ranger?
TSCCC IC
Steffa97
Wolven Brute
Wolven Brute
Posts: 592
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:49 pm

Re: Updated

Fri Apr 11, 2014 7:13 pm

Sek wrote:
Steffa97 wrote:Ground based melee, as much as I like it, won't work in this Aracoix/Scout/Aracoix-Scout-bane world we have going on so I tweaked my template a bit to thoroughly cremate scouts if they're dumb enough to start the attack.
Still Aelfborn for snare-break
Same starting runes
Discs -
Traveler (optional)
Gladiator (Preferred but not really required, replace Black Mask need be)
Black Mask (free passwall, can be replaced with Glad)
Blade Master
Archer
25CON
30DEX

Stats at 75
DEX - 160
CON - 120
INT - 74

Gold
Bow
Archery
Light Armor

Take Beastcraft to 115 and put a point in Wolfskin. Emergency heal, small stat buff, GM mana-based weapon powers
Take Briallia's Power to 18 and GM the zeal. JM Precision and Feint <----- the reason I still have Blade Master
GM the Ranger heal (it should be going off for around 110-410) and it's free bleed remove. Gladiator also gives health regen, and with the Ranger heal, you should be outhealing most bow scouts anyway.
Jewels are either 20DEX, or 10DEX/CON with health recovery. If you get a full set of Vorg (which I wholeheartedly recommend), feel free to go full-con. At the end you should be sitting with around 3250HP with all dex jewels, and around 3600 with dex/con. The LA hood can also be subbed for another con hood for extra HR/HP, that'll bring you to about 3750 with con jewels.
Defense with full-dex jewels, and +8def/pierce resist Ranger LA is resting at about 2050.
ATR with Feint/Precision stacked is pushing slightly over 3,000. You should be able to blast scouts for almost 250-300 a hit consistently without weapon powers while he's barely tickling you. Not to mention your heals will keep you alive much better than the best one a Scout can get, which is the RC heal.

Nice build.

Now, a few suggestions/questions:

- Is going Aelf really worth it? With level 30 archery powers your snare will be 41% (if the Wiki is correct, until checking it out tonight I was under the impression that GM weapon powers give you 41% snares). Most scouts, with spiked running should be faster than you, even if you keep that snare on them.

- No points into dodge? Not that it`s mandatory, but I like to put at least 10 trains in.

- Is JM-ing Feint necessary? Ok, you need good ATR, but just remember, Feint also gives you an attack speed debuff, that scales with trains...

- Also, I dislike going over 90 trains into anything on a Ranger, simply because there are always other useful stuff to spend trains on.

And finally, one straight-out question:
- Would you train up Find Weakness on your bow ranger?
Dodge gets a few points, once everything else is trained. It's alright IMO just other things are more important
JM Feint is I believe a -20% attack speed debuff but it's not as slow as you may think. 3200+ATR is pretty nice.
About the trains, well to be honest this is my first ranger. It's extra ATR/DEF/Damage vs more trains. Currently this build sits at 1375ATR D-stance, around 90-460 damage, and 2-2.2k defense depending on jewels.
Aelfborn isn't required, but I can't tell you how many times the snare break with the class sprint has saved my skin. I use it more defensively. By all means go human for wererat and extra trains if you wish.
Find Weakness I wouldn't touch here, you practically have to be right next to them to cast it.
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kymatius
Snobo Seer
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Posts: 103
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Re: Updated

Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:30 am

If making this Ranger for pure Scout killing why go Rogue? If a Scout is going to engage you they can pop your stealth anyways and already know your there with GM Track. Would be more beneficial to go Fighter Aelf for the 34% damage buff of Fighter Off stance and going regen w/ Gladiator. A Scout would never be able to do enough damage by themselves to kill your regen and you can back that up by going resist Elven Medium Armor. I would also GM Wolfskin since the form completely kicks @$$. Your stat layout looks good and for runes on a fighter based I would go Gladiator, BM, Archer, and 4th your choice. All in all a fun toon but not nearly as effective as a bow Huntress at dealing with Scouts. A good level of Int and Poison DoT & Bleed = dead scout also slightly better bow powers from 35 ranger to 40 huntress and a lvl 35 off Stance instead of a lvl 20.

Zoops had a killer Human nuketress that I never could beat on my rogues. He could offer some good advice...would link the old forum post but the waybackmachine doesnt have it.
Steffa97
Wolven Brute
Wolven Brute
Posts: 592
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:49 pm

Re: Updated

Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:49 am

Actually thinking about rolling a fighter-based ranger if for nothing else the extra oomph on O-stance. Good advice btw.
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Sek
Snowy Mino
Snowy Mino
Posts: 727
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:31 am

Re: Updated

Sun Apr 13, 2014 1:18 pm

kymatius wrote:If making this Ranger for pure Scout killing why go Rogue?

The problem with killing scouts with a Ranger is almost always catching up, and keeping up with the suckers.
Going Aelf helps, though from my experience that alone is not enough. Even Vamps (after I snare them with the bow snare) are fast enough to get away.
I contemplated training GoT, but that spell is so Skah!, I just can`t make myself to...
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Steffa97
Wolven Brute
Wolven Brute
Posts: 592
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:49 pm

Re: Updated

Sun Apr 13, 2014 5:06 pm

Sek wrote:
kymatius wrote:If making this Ranger for pure Scout killing why go Rogue?

The problem with killing scouts with a Ranger is almost always catching up, and keeping up with the suckers.
Going Aelf helps, though from my experience that alone is not enough. Even Vamps (after I snare them with the bow snare) are fast enough to get away.
I contemplated training GoT, but that spell is so Skah!, I just can`t make myself to...
It's okay, most scouts are so terrible at playing the toon nowadays that they don't know when they've lost and need to leave. If they do get away, if nothing else they'll leave you alone because they'll realize it's a fight they won't win. Whenever they attack me all I do is pop P-stance, feint, and the Archer ATR buff, def/atr cut the scout and laugh as they miss every single shot and I pound away at them. Still kinda thinking about making a fighter variant just for the extra O-stance oomph and additional HP. Maybe do a regen-based fighter?

And the damage sucks but I'd always take GoT to 5 to ground unnatural fliers if my GS is down. It definitely could use a small boost though. At the very least make the casting time in line with the Druid counterpart.
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Loogie
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Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 8:40 am

hang on a sec, to the original poster, gm-ing ranger heal removes bleeds? I thought glad was the only thing that could remove bleeds?
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Fugger
Snow Terror
Snow Terror
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Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:45 pm

Ive actually never tested that myself. But..any ranger build should have gladiator, so it's kind of a moot point.
tooshifty
Ice Drake
Ice Drake
Posts: 2959
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Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:51 pm

feint's atk speed debuff lessens the more you train it.

grasp of thorns got some love on rangers and take much less time to cast. i uusually gm it on my rangers and it really saves my bacon-same with the heal.
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OLDSCHOOL
a.k.a. Shifty
a.k.a. Tenshi
a.k.a. Jin
Steffa97
Wolven Brute
Wolven Brute
Posts: 592
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:49 pm

Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 3:39 pm

tooshifty wrote:feint's atk speed debuff lessens the more you train it.

grasp of thorns got some love on rangers and take much less time to cast. i uusually gm it on my rangers and it really saves my bacon-same with the heal.
When I was training it, I noticed the delay scaling upward (from 10% to 20% I believe)

It's still barely noticeable. Well worth it in order to hit ANYTHING on the server. The snare on GoT is nice but doesn't the damage scale horribly?
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kymatius
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Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 5:53 pm

I always loved pierce exposing/FW and then putting on GoT w/ a reasonable int can really hurt.
Steffa97
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Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 6:11 pm

Loogie wrote:hang on a sec, to the original poster, gm-ing ranger heal removes bleeds? I thought glad was the only thing that could remove bleeds?
ANY heal will remove ANY bleed relative to it's power rank.

A pr-15 heal will remove pr-15 bleeds and below.
Any bleeding damage an unarmed scout puts on you can be negated by rune caster.
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Loogie
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Re: Updated

Sun Apr 20, 2014 8:09 pm

first of all, dig the sabaton themed signature. But as for the heals and bleeds, thats good to know. I feel like i remember that from way back when but its been awhile since i've thought about this stuff. i guess a gm-ed ranger heal wouldn't be a bad alternative until you could get a glad, provided you refined down later.
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Steffa97
Wolven Brute
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Re: Updated

Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:42 pm

Loogie wrote:first of all, dig the sabaton themed signature. But as for the heals and bleeds, thats good to know. I feel like i remember that from way back when but its been awhile since i've thought about this stuff. i guess a gm-ed ranger heal wouldn't be a bad alternative until you could get a glad, provided you refined down later.
Thanks for the kind words about my sig! As for the heal, it's saved me multiple times. The heal's definitely not as bad as people make it out to be though, as it has a focus line. It's ticking for 200-430 and for a 3 second cast it's not that bad. Probably going to refine it down as soon as a gladiator comes around though.
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Zoopz
Chilled Zombie
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Re: Updated

Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:20 am

Feint is poop.

All my Aelf Rangers are broads, and I sacrifice the 5 int for valkyr.
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Shax wrote:The Darwin Awards better watch out for Zoopz.
Swing wrote:Zoopz, I think you should have your sig's ears flash on an off, too. There's just not enough animation in that sig.
Fugger
Snow Terror
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Re: Updated

Wed Apr 23, 2014 1:30 pm

ya feint is crap. Need I remind you guys that you have a GM precise stance and access to plenty of atr boosts and def cuts, you really don't need feint.
Sek
Snowy Mino
Snowy Mino
Posts: 727
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:31 am

Re: Updated

Thu May 08, 2014 1:20 am

Fugger wrote:ya feint is crap. Need I remind you guys that you have a GM precise stance and access to plenty of atr boosts and def cuts, you really don't need feint.
Most rogue rangers definetely need Feint.
At least 1 train.
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Zoopz
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Re: Updated

Thu May 08, 2014 9:50 am

Sek wrote:
Fugger wrote:ya feint is crap. Need I remind you guys that you have a GM precise stance and access to plenty of atr boosts and def cuts, you really don't need feint.
Most rogue rangers definetely need Feint.
At least 1 train.
Depends on your weapon, and NEEEEEEED is a lil strong.
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Shax wrote:The Darwin Awards better watch out for Zoopz.
Swing wrote:Zoopz, I think you should have your sig's ears flash on an off, too. There's just not enough animation in that sig.
Loogie
Snobo
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Posts: 78
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 6:14 pm

Re: Updated

Fri May 23, 2014 5:43 pm

kymatius wrote:If making this Ranger for pure Scout killing why go Rogue? If a Scout is going to engage you they can pop your stealth anyways and already know your there with GM Track. Would be more beneficial to go Fighter Aelf for the 34% damage buff of Fighter Off stance and going regen w/ Gladiator. A Scout would never be able to do enough damage by themselves to kill your regen and you can back that up by going resist Elven Medium Armor. I would also GM Wolfskin since the form completely kicks @$$. Your stat layout looks good and for runes on a fighter based I would go Gladiator, BM, Archer, and 4th your choice. All in all a fun toon but not nearly as effective as a bow Huntress at dealing with Scouts. A good level of Int and Poison DoT & Bleed = dead scout also slightly better bow powers from 35 ranger to 40 huntress and a lvl 35 off Stance instead of a lvl 20.

Zoops had a killer Human nuketress that I never could beat on my rogues. He could offer some good advice...would link the old forum post but the waybackmachine doesnt have it.
Sorry to dredge up an old thread, but I was thinking the same thing too ^. Why go rogue if you're purposefully making this to willingly court engagements with scouts. Go fighter and let it all hang out (in a manner of speaking). I suppose the answer could be dependent on more of a playstyle thing ---- if you're going nonranged weapons, stealth would be a boon just to pop up next to non-scout toons, like on a UA ranger. But there is one other thing to consider, I've built a fighter bow ranger in the past and their stamina pool left a lot to be desired, while the rogue version of the same toon was much higher.... I know rogues get a one point stam bonus over fighters, but that alone can't surely account for the vast difference between fighter and rogue ranger stamina pools.
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Steffa97
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Re: Updated

Thu May 29, 2014 2:34 pm

Wolf's vigor can be trained on rangers need be (1 pt is 35%, JM is 140% and GM is 250%). Also at GM the Wolfskin heal puts all of your stamina back on. Even at JM it's 60%.
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